This is an English translation of a conversation with yuri mangaka Amano Shuninta regarding her new manga, I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved (ai saretemo iindayo). It is currently only available in Japanese, so I’ve chosen to go with its most popular English name.
This one is a particularly interesting conversation due to the story’s subject matter – the lesbian sex service industry in Japan. While most people probably hadn’t realized the industry existed prior to the release of the popular My Lesbian Experience With Loneliness by Nagata Kabi, one of the longest-running companies, Lesbian Girls Club, has been around for over a decade. Amano Shuninta sits down with Obou, the owner of the establishment, to discuss the industry and the people in it.
The original article was published in two parts on July 25th, 2020 on the news website, Gendai Business. You can find it here.
More And More Girls Are Getting Addicted to “Lesbian Sex Service”… The Secrets of “A New Pleasure”
What exactly goes on there?
“Lesbian Sex Service… That exists?!” That’s how 23-year-old office lady Rin, the main character of I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved (serialized in Comic DAYS), reacts when she’s shown the homepage of “Yuritopia: Girls Only Lesbian Sex Service” by a girl she’s just met. Many readers probably felt the same way. The era in which the sex industry is a man’s world is ending. Sex services for women, and among them, for women to be serviced by women, are on the rise.
I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved tells the story of Rin, who becomes a cast member of a lesbian sex service after trying them as a customer. We bring you a conversation between its author Amano Shuninta and Obou, a representative from lesbian sex service “Lesbian Girls Club.” Founded in 2007, Lesbian Girls Club is a popular company with three stores in Tokyo and Osaka. They participated in providing reference material for the manga as well.
Yes, Lesbian Sex Services Actually Exist!
Obou: I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved is so interesting! I’m on the management side of a lesbian sex service, and what’s more, I’m a guy, so I have no idea what it looks like between a cast member and a customer. I was wondering, “Is it really like that?” while reading the manga, so it had a touch of reality for me.
Amano: Thank you very much. The manga I draw all fall under the “yuri” genre, which means they depict romance and sex between girls. The topic of lesbian sex services came up in yuri every so often and I had read some stories about them, but I always thought they were just fiction. But then I read Nagata Kabi’s manga, My Lesbian Experience With Loneliness (East Press, 2016) and was shocked to find they actually existed.
Obou: The shop that Nagata-san went to was ours. We have a lot of customers who first heard of our services from that manga as well.
Amano: I wondered what kind of women would use those services, and what kind of women would work for them… My curiosity was quite piqued.
Obou: This might be a bit of a boring answer, but our customers are all perfectly normal women. We have people as young as around 20 to people as old as about 70. They come from a variety of occupations as well. It’s called “lesbian sex service,” but the customers’ sexuality differ extensively. There are few who self-identify as lesbian, and the majority are either bisexual or heterosexual. Some even have male partners, like a husband or boyfriend. And of course, there are many who are unsure of their sexuality and are trying it to find out.
Amano: The cast members are all normal people as well. When I was interviewing for research, I went to the main office for “Lesbian Girls Club,” but the atmosphere was like everyone was working at a wonderful cafe. When I saw one of the boi types* sweep out the door, it felt so refreshing and nice.
[Cast are generally divided by their physical appearance: feminine ones are called “femme,” more boyish ones are called “boi,” and those who fall in the middle are “chuusei.”]
Obou: In the manga, Rin is a salaried office worker at a company, but she faces trouble with both her work and her relationships with her co-workers, and she seems quite exhausted. Just as she’s wondering if she can really continue on like that… she comes into contact with the world of the lesbian sex industry. There are many girls working there who feel quite similarly to her.
Amano: Popular works about lesbian sex services have become quite common now, but women who are not particularly sexually active might still think it’s a world far away from them. So I started imagining what sort of reason a normal girl would have to enter that industry. I felt like they must be quite courageous.
Obou: I often feel the same way when looking at customers in real life. There are many people who tell us in their first reservation, “I’ve known about this company for years, but I’ve finally decided to give it a try.”
Amano: Taking that first step must be a huge turning point in their life.
Your Life Will Change Forever
Obou: Sex services for women in general are still quite uncommon.
Amano: It’s often said there are none at all.
Obou: Shops with men who service women exist as well, but there are many who think, “It feels safer and not as scary between women.”
Amano: Precisely because of that, I feel like there is a difference between girls who’ve used lesbian sex services and those who haven’t. Nagata Kabi was like that as well…
Obou: And Rin, too, right?
Amano: Yes, it was a point of no return for her that changed her life. I think that’s one aspect of lesbian sex sevices.
Rin meets a cast member named “Ryou” by coincidence and ends up sleeping with her. After that, she ends up making a crucial decision. It was just for a moment, but Ryou treated her as someone special, and from there, she was able to let out the true feelings she’d been keeping a lid on and treat them as important. That’s when the setting moves to the “Yuritopia: Girls Only Lesbian Sex Service” shop.
Sex services for men have always been around, but they’ve always been seen as a place to satisfy the sexual appetites of the body. It’s hard to draw a simple and direct comparison, but sex services for girls put more of an emphasis on “conversation.”
Obou: That’s why I believe the date course, which allows the customer to enjoy a date with the cast member before going to a hotel, is very important. It’s basically unheard of for male-oriented sex services, but most lesbian sex services have that option – not just our store. Many of our customers have a date before selecting the “lesbian course” where they spend time together at a hotel.
In I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved, the characters watch a movie, have tea together, and have fun shopping. Girls go out together as friends all the time, but how do the cast members make the girls feel the different excitement of going on a date… They might offer their arm, for example.
Amano: Actually, one of the female editors tried out a date course. When she was having tea with the tomboyish cast member, she fed her cake with her spoon. When a boy does it, it might be embarrassing and uncomfortable, but the cast member apparently did it so naturally that she accepted it without even thinking. I really related to that. The obstacles in front of getting spoiled seems to be fewer among girls. It feels like a natural extension from being friends, but it’s a little bit exciting anyway.
Obou: I definitely want to see a scene like that in the manga! It feels fine because it’s between girls, right? In heterosexual shoujo manga, getting fed by the other person is so cliche now that it’s not done anymore.
Amano: That may be so. In yuri, scenes about sharing food and clothes are classics. Between men and women, the woman might stay over at the man’s house and borrow his shirt and it’ll be too big. There’s a term for that called “boyfriend shirt.” True “shaing,” however, is only possible with couples of the same gender.
Obou: In lesbian sex services, the client and the cast member also has a distance between them that doesn’t exist among real friends, so customers often want to talk about things they can’t discuss with their friends or family. Topics like sexuality and physical problems are difficult to bring up. As you become an adult, the number of things you can’t talk about with anyone increases. Because they’re having a secret sort of relationship with the cast member, they can talk more freely.
Amano: I totally get that.
Being Unable To Say What You Want To Do
Obou: When Rin experiences the lesbian sex service for the first time, she hesitates about enjoying the sex. She’s worried that she’ll be hated for being perverted, and is unable to let go.
Amano: She’s unable to say what she wants to do. There aren’t many Japanese girls who can clearly state what they want out loud in general, not just in terms of sex. I’m quite indecisive, myself. Even if I want something, I’ll often think, “I really don’t want to be hated for saying it.”
Obou: We actually get customers who ask us, “What if people think I’m a pervert?” before they use our service. We also have a box on our reservation form that allows customers to specify any particular desires they might have, but many people leave that empty.
Amano: Rin is able to overcome that and move forward a little.
Obou: There are many stages before the customer gets to that point. Once the client has requested a cast member and visited them many times, they become able to convey their hopes and desires. It’s a little strange that they’re worried about being perceived as perverted when they’re signing up for a lesbian course at a sex service. I often want to say, “I mean, that’s what you’re here for!” Haha.
Amano: People don’t want to be thought of as weird. They want to stay normal… Or rather, they’re afraid of sticking out, I think. How do you reply to their questions, Obou-san?
Obou: “It’ll be fine.” “Please don’t worry.” I think that’s what they want to hear.
Amano: They just want a little push.
Obou: But in the end, it’s their decision. Rin has several scenes where she needs to make important decisions. I was quite impressed with how the cast members of the store used wonderful methods to help her make them.
Amano: I also feel that making a decision on my own is quite scary. If you’re proactive and make judgements on your own, then you have to shoulder the entire responsibility of it. I think there are many people who want to share their burden with someone else.
The “Appreciation” Course
After a girl gets that push and enters the world of the lesbian sex industry, what experiences can they have? Instant gratification is not the only thing available. There is also the empathy and intimacy that can only blossom between two women. It’s not only pleasure; lifestyle and worlds also mix in that relationship that is romantic, friendly, and sisterly all at once. In Rin’s tale, she matures as her experiences pile upon each other.
Obou: Before I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved started publication, you came to us for an “appreciation course” for research, right? It’s a course unique to “Lesbian Appreciation Club Tiara” in which the customer can watch two of our cast members without participating or being touched. How was it for you?
Amano: I was surprised. You rarely get to watch other people’s sexual activity, let alone the sexual activity of two girls. Seeing it all laid out in front of me… I was pretty hesitant at first, but I ended up getting sucked in. Do men often use this course?
Obou: We started it due to requests from men, but it’s quite popular among heterosexual couples now. The number of girls who use it with their friends is increasing as well.
Amano: Why do the girls do it, I wonder?
Obou: It’s primarily out of curiosity. Like, “How do two girls do it?” We often get reviews such as, “It was beautiful,” and “My body responded to it.” We did have a weird experience of someone sketching for a doujin while our cast members were engaging with each other. Photos are prohibited, but sketches are fine.
Amano: I can see how that might come in handy! I often draw girls entangling with each other, and scenes like that come up in I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved as well. In manga, however, composition must be very clear, so the positions are pretty much already decided. It’s totally different from seeing real bodies move.
Obou: You can tell them what positions to take, you know. We often have individuals who create their own scenarios and have our cast act them out. There are rules for it, as there are for the date course and the lesbian course, but everyone has their own ways to enjoy their selection. The company itself has no say in what they do. It’s a collaboration between the cast member and the client. It was so relaxing.
The Real Faces of Cast Members
Amano: After watching, I visited the office, which left quite an impression as well. It felt more like someone’s house than an office.
Obou: When it comes to a prostitution service, people imagine a drab office with posters listing forbidden activities and rules, with the female cast members waiting… but if it were me, being somewhere like that would make me quite nervous. The cast members also won’t be able to serve the clients well like that, so we made sure the office was a calming place.
Amano: How did the cast members start working there?
Obou: It’s really different for each person… How about talking directly to one of them? She’s just coming back from a job right now.
Amano: Yes, please!
[Mako-san, who’s worked for “Lesbian Appreciation Club Tiara” for 2 years, is a petite, cheerful girl with an ever-present smile.]
Mako: Why did I start working here, you ask? At the time, I needed the money. But back then, I didn’t understand the sex service industry at all. I didn’t think it was bad or anything, but I thought that since it was related to sex, both the client and the employee don’t really talk about it with anyone… That’s the only impression I had.
In addition, the Lesbian Girls Club company had already been around for 10 years, so I figured there wouldn’t be much trouble with either the company nor the customers. I didn’t think I was cut out for interacting directly with men, so I definitely couldn’t choose to work at a sex service for men or a cabaret.
Amano: How did you feel after starting?
Mako: I felt like it was extremely normal. It’s a place for people to meet other people. It’s not just about sex. But doing it just for the sex is fine too. What’s important is respecting the person in front of you for the time that you two are together… That’s what left a real impact on me. Among the customers, there are some who have personally supported the cast members even while during the coronavirus lockdown.
Obou: During the coronavirus quarantine, we couldn’t have normal operations, so we set up a service where clients could have conversations with our cast members through text or over the phone. There were some customers who used it because they were worried our cast members were suffering from having no work, but there were also individuals who wanted to talk with them before using our service to choose someone to reserve, so I think it was beneficial for both the clients and the cast members. We’ll be continuing this service in the future.
Mako: I was moved because the customers were trying to support us, even when they must be having a hard time themselves. I started because I needed money, and using the service doesn’t come cheaply to the clients at all, so I wanted to make it worth their while. But it’s definitely not just a matter of money to me.
Amano: I think it’s obvious that the cast members aren’t only doing it for the money. If it was just to get rich, working for a sex service aimed towards men would be much more prolific. That’s why I figured there are a lot of cast members who specifically want to do this job.
Obou: That’s how it is for the characters in I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved as well, right? They have some sort of goal or something that they want to do, so they started working at a sex service for lesbians. Just like you said, the market for our industry is much smaller than the sex service industry for men, and it’s pretty hard to make a living on this job alone. Although if that’s what they really want, I do my best to help them achieve that goal, and we have a few employees who are able to sustain themselves solely through the money they make through us.
Mako: I’ve had so many good things happen every day ever since I became a cast member. The customers need me in their lives, and they accept me for who I am. I really want to keep doing this forever.
How Are Cast Members Chosen?
Amano: Thank you very much, Mako-san! After meeting the cast members for real, I feel like it would be hard to become popular from physical appearance alone. It’s different from the male sex industry, where there are many clients who probably decide from face pics and bust size alone. Obou-san, what points do you look out for when recruiting?
Obou: Well, physical appearance is definitely important. Rather than just looking at the face, I also focus on their overall look of cleanliness and attractiveness. Their manner of speaking, posture, and first impression are all important. Also, this is very subjective, but their “chances of climbing the ranks” as well.
Amano: Like, if they look like they’ll sell well, or something?
Obou: Well, let’s see… We sometimes have women who come saying that they were popular at a different company, but that doesn’t mean they’ll match the feel of our company. If it doesn’t look like our customers will reserve them, then I won’t recruit them even if they have experience. The characters in I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved are all unique individuals, too, right?
Amano: I think the number of characters will increase as the story progresses.
Obou: I feel like there will be all sorts of drama between them… To be honest, in our company, romance between employees is strictly forbidden. Love between cast members can basically only exist in a lesbian sex service, but when I first opened the company, I didn’t realize that at all. Thanks to that, my troubles wouldn’t end. That’s why I’ve prohibited it now.
Amano: Sounds like it was quite a hassle, haha.
The Modern State Of Yuri
[It can be said that lesbian sex services are a barometer of girls’ sexuality. Girls who feel they have to act a certain way and are repressed in their daily lives entangle their bodies with the cast members’ bodies, reaffirming their gender and reclaiming it. Where will I Wouldn’t Mind Being Loved’s main character, Rin, go from here on out?
Obou: The manga that you write can mostly be categorized as part of the yuri genre. What kind of readers does that genre have?
Amano: In general, there are a lot of male readers, but my own works have many female fans as well, and a lot of lesbians have told me that they consume my manga as well. There are some readers who can feel the reality of “relationships between women” and relate to it as an extension of their own lives, but there are also readers who view it as something closer to fantasy. It depends on the person.
Obou: Is it easier for women to say out loud that they like yuri manga and novels these days?
Amano: I think it’s mostly accepted now. Even if they advertise their preference, it’s usually accepted with indifference. Although, depending on the person, some of the askers might get a little bit of a shock…
Obou: It’s a bit similar to the lesbian sex industry. There are a customers who don’t think it’s a bad thing, but don’t want anyone to know they’re using it. But we’re getting increasing amount of young customers who make reservations after hearing from their friends about how good it is. I hope that both yuri manga fans and lesbian sex service users will be able to confidently say what they are in the future!
Wolf Translations 